Do you believe in hell? I’ve been asking that question ever since it was recently reported (or ‘misreported’) that the current Pope has denied there is such a place, at least in any meaningful sense. I say ‘misreported’ because it was later ‘reported’ that the 93 year old atheist who interviewed him had taken no notes during their conversation. He simply “kind of remembered” what the Pontiff had said.

Not surprisingly The Catholic Herald was scathing in its assessment of his meetings with the 93-year-old founder of Italy’s centre-left daily, La Repubblica. “Even if Pope Francis believes that Scalfari’s soul depends on continuing their conversations” it declared he must know that the inevitable results “are confusion and scandal”.

Now given his atheism I would assume Scalfari would not acknowledge the existence of hell. I would assume the opposite when it comes to the head of the Roman Catholic Church. But I have to admit I was hugely surprised to find support for the concept of hell flowing from the pen of Sunday Times’ columnist Rod Liddle.

“We might prefer to be nonjudgmental because it suits the kind of people we think we are” he wrote, “But even so it is still useful”.

Is hell nothing more than a useful fiction then? Is it an idea that has had its day? Or does the word signify a sobering truth? Given the uncertainty and confusion that followed Scalfari’s conversation with the Pope I thought I would go back and check out what Jesus said. And the record is quite clear: most of what we know about hell comes from the lips of the kindest person who has ever lived.

And He used the word ‘Gehenna’. It was the place where they dumped the city rubbish and it was where they would have thrown his body too if Joseph of Arimethea had not stepped in and offered his tomb. Now that’s a sobering picture if there ever was one.

It seems to me that many of those who react most strongly to the concept of hell have been influenced by the grotesque medieval pictures of tortured bodies writhing in a furnace.

Sadly those graphic depictions only serve to obscure the real teaching of Jesus and make it easier for people to discount its true nature.

And we need to understand that as far as Jesus was concerned the only people who end up in hell opt for it. As CS Lewis once said: “There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, ‘Thy will be done’, and those to whom God says, in the end, ‘Thy will be done.’ It’s as if He says ‘Well if you want to live without me you can. For ever’

Now much of what I have said will only make sense if you believe in God. And you can’t even be guaranteed of that in the church according to Liddle.

I quote: “A few years ago I was chatting to a very senior Church of England bishop about the notion of Hell. Does Hell exist I asked the chap ingeniously.

“Oh Rod don’t be so ------ stupid”. Ah OK. Then what about God? He looked a bit conflicted at this question, mused for a while and then wobbled his hand about a bit. Maybe, maybe not”

“That’s the thing” said Liddle. “You start pulling at the loose threads on the sweater and soon the whole thing unravels. But me, I think we still need the sweater”. I can only say Amen to that.

Rob James is a Baptist Pastor broadcaster and writer who currently operates as a church and media consultant for the Evangelical Alliance Wales. He is available for preaching and teaching throughout Wales and can be contacted at [email protected]